[Etx1]

I tend to run it in A/B as my oldish ears cannot really make out the difference. Seeing you are in high gain at 85-90 I suspect an external amp would make a significant difference.
My 109's are pretty easy to drive however after I messed about with the PEQ I lost a lot of volume, was at around 75 High Gain, that is the reason why I bought the Singxer as wanted more headroom.
Now am on low gain on amp and medium gain on hiby and rarely go over 12 'o'clock on the amp.

 

[Joe Bloggs]

Anything other than that? I'll give it a shot but it's not a level playing field anymore.

what earphones were you using, do you know their impedance response curve? (not FR curve, and not the nominal impedance)

Other than that, it's true that it won't be a level playing field, but I don't think our brand plays from a level playing field given the breadth and depth of tuning options available in the firmware

 

[seanwee]

what earphones were you using, do you know their impedance response curve? (not FR curve, and not the nominal impedance)

Other than that, it's true that it won't be a level playing field, but I don't think our brand plays from a level playing field given the breadth and depth of tuning options available in the firmware

For bass I was using the KZ Pr2, a relatively power hungry planar iem.

 

[Joe Bloggs]

For bass I was using the KZ Pr2, a relatively power hungry planar iem.

I see you run a squig.link. If anyone were in the mood for shedding some hard numbers on the issue, they can always simply use different DAPs as the source for FR tests. To reduce the margin of error, instead of using a coupler, you can run the DAP headphone out straight into the measurement line in. Just insert the earphones in question as a load for the system via a Y-split between the DAP and the line in.

If you add an impedance adapter into the mix, you can even be the first person to measure the impedance response of the PR2 itself

 

[seanwee]

I see you run a squig.link. If anyone were in the mood for shedding some hard numbers on the issue, they can always simply use different DAPs as the source for FR tests. To reduce the margin of error, instead of using a coupler, you can run the DAP headphone out straight into the measurement line in. Just insert the earphones in question as a load for the system via a Y-split between the DAP and the line in.

If you add an impedance adapter into the mix, you can even be the first person to measure the impedance response of the PR2 itself

So I'll just be measuring the raw fr output of the DAP? I'm not sure what you want me to look for exactly.

Don't all sources measure essentially flat?

I read a review saying that it may just be the R6 Pro II lacking voltage/current swing for more demanding iems/headphones resulting in less bass slam

 

[Joe Bloggs]

So I'll just be measuring the raw fr output of the DAP? I'm not sure what you want me to look for exactly.

Don't all sources measure essentially flat?

I read a review saying that it may just be the R6 Pro II lacking voltage/current swing for more demanding iems/headphones resulting in less bass slam

If you connect the DAP hp out to the measurement line input in parallel with your choice of earphones, you are measuring the loaded output of the DAP when driving your choice of earphones, i.e. the electronic FR as actually received by your earphones.

No, not all sources measure flat in this situation. If they did, you shouldn't hear any tonal differences between sources with your choice of earphones.

It would depend, at regular volumes, on the relationship between the output impedance of the amplifier and the impedance response of the earphones.

If the former is not negligible (i.e. near zero), the circuit is a voltage divider between the output impedance and the earphone impedance. The output FR then takes on some of the shape of the earphone impedance response curve.

Now, most sources do actually have near zero OI, and many dynamic and planar single driver earphones also have near flat FR. Either of these conditions can result in a flat measured FR even when loaded, but it is not a given.

At extreme volumes you might get a change in the FR again, but then you'd also be seeing a massive increase in THD if so.

You may test that last hypothesis by cranking the volume when doing the measurement, assuming your line in doesn't clip.

And if that ends up frying your earphones' drivers, that might alert you to the possibility that these DAPs have plenty enough voltage / current swing to blow earphones up before losing gas

 

[seanwee]

If you connect the DAP hp out to the measurement line input in parallel with your choice of earphones, you are measuring the loaded output of the DAP when driving your choice of earphones, i.e. the electronic FR as actually received by your earphones.

No, not all sources measure flat in this situation. If they did, you shouldn't hear any tonal differences between sources with your choice of earphones.

It would depend, at regular volumes, on the relationship between the output impedance of the amplifier and the impedance response of the earphones.

If the former is not negligible (i.e. near zero), the circuit is a voltage divider between the output impedance and the earphone impedance. The output FR then takes on some of the shape of the earphone impedance response curve.

Now, most sources do actually have near zero OI, and many dynamic and planar single driver earphones also have near flat FR. Either of these conditions can result in a flat measured FR even when loaded, but it is not a given.

At extreme volumes you might get a change in the FR again, but then you'd also be seeing a massive increase in THD if so.

You may test that last hypothesis by cranking the volume when doing the measurement, assuming your line in doesn't clip.

Definitely interested in measuring this but as I was setting up the rig I realised a problem, I can't measure balanced in.

And if that was struggling with power then single ended is bound to run out of power.

 

[Joe Bloggs]

Definitely interested in measuring this but as I was setting up the rig I realised a problem, I can't measure balanced in.

And if that was struggling with power then single ended is bound to run out of power.

I wouldn't worry about running out of power with either output to be honest...

If any output were struggling for power at any frequency, it would be notable in the form of distortion way before it affected gross balance of bass and treble note weight.

You yourself pointed out it's probably not that.

 

[Joe Bloggs]

Definitely interested in measuring this but as I was setting up the rig I realised a problem, I can't measure balanced in.

And if that was struggling with power then single ended is bound to run out of power.

I suppose you can fall back on measuring different sources playing to the mic in through earphones and then the coupler--though the margin of error with that method increases considerably.

 

[o0genesis0o]

I read a review saying that it may just be the R6 Pro II lacking voltage/current swing for more demanding iems/headphones resulting in less bass slam

Idk whether the R6 P2 has less "bass slam." In fact, I found it to be more dynamic and punchy than my iBasso DX300, which apparently can output up to 1.2W from 4.4mm output. The class A on R6P2 sounds pretty nice if you are into recording with a lot of spatial information.

That said, I didn't have a chance to test it with the likes of Symphonium Crimson or FF Scarlet Mini. That bass cannon from FF brings many sources to their knees whilst the Crimson can push normal headphone jacks to distortion easily.

 

[Colif]

You may consider updating directly to the latest via a manual download: https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/119DHgE-XISrIQaMl1TOGRvVXHnDNaUf7

Once the file is copied to the device or SD card, go to firmware update in settings and tap the 3-dot / hamburger button upper right and select Update from Local file

You may have missed the part where I am not getting anything at all on my screen. It makes it hard to do

I have arranged an rma, will send it back to store tomorrow and get a replacement one - I have asked them to flash latest firmware onto it for me so I don't have a repeat. I expect it was just a bad unit.

thank you for your answers. I won't post again until I have used the new one for a while.

 

[nioh]

You may have missed the part where I am not getting anything at all on my screen. It makes it hard to do

I have arranged an rma, will send it back to store tomorrow and get a replacement one - I have asked them to flash latest firmware onto it for me so I don't have a repeat. I expect it was just a bad unit.

thank you for your answers. I won't post again until I have used the new one for a while.

Just a stupid question. Did you try operating the DAP after removing the case ? The stock case has a tendency to press some of the buttons accidentally and this might cause the DAP to not boot up properly.

 

[Colif]

Just a stupid question. Did you try operating the DAP after removing the case ? The stock case has a tendency to press some of the buttons accidentally and this might cause the DAP to not boot up properly.

No problems. I did all of the key combos suggested with the case off as I am still learning which button is which, so I needed to be able to see them to press them in.

I just tried the android restart command of Power + volume down and it gives no reaction. I know its on as the blue led is only sign of life.

I can't turn it off withoutn a screen so I have to wait for it to run out of power before I can start it without any buttons pressed in and see if it boots right.
I was waiting for it to run out of power but that may take a while. Without a working screen I have no clue how much power it has left.

I spent the last few days trying to ignore it. Feeling sorry for myself, trying to keep mind occupied on anything else.

 

[Etx1]

I suspect you have a lemon, happens in everything and as long as it is exchanged it will be fine
Imagine if it was a brand new car.

 

[Joe Bloggs]

You may have missed the part where I am not getting anything at all on my screen. It makes it hard to do

I have arranged an rma, will send it back to store tomorrow and get a replacement one - I have asked them to flash latest firmware onto it for me so I don't have a repeat. I expect it was just a bad unit.

thank you for your answers. I won't post again until I have used the new one for a while.

Yes I was suggesting that for a replacement unit but all good if they are going to update it for you first